Author Topic: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?  (Read 1701 times)

TrainingTheDragon

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Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« on: February 06, 2013, 09:44:07 PM »
I'm hearing this term being tossed around like a pigskin these days.

Last year, when the forum was smaller, the term flatline was used to signify a phase with non-existent libido after abstaining from porn for a while. It was seen as a good thing and a sign of the healing process, lasting for one to a few weeks usually. The general pattern was one would start abstaining and urges to PMO would increase in intensity with each day until one fine day, you wake up feeling practically asexual. At which point you could congratulate yourself for making it through to the next step in recovery.

Now as I read the posts, members use it to describe just about ANY dip in libido. I've seen it being used to describe how people feel during or after PMO binges. Heck, one poster thought he was in flatline during all his years of PMOing. It does feel like some people are confusing the effects of PMOing with flatlining.

I even read about someone MOing so he could get out of the flatline - something I don't understand in any way. Why would one want to interrupt the healing process?

Has the meaning just been lost or is there a new definition for this word now? I'd like to speak the same language when we're all speaking English.

Unstable

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2013, 12:12:24 AM »
Agreed, people are now using the term “flatline” way too loosely. Some even claim they flatline within a couple of days starting PMO. That makes no sense whatsoever. Individuals are confusing not being horny with flatlining. 


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gameover

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2013, 02:25:05 AM »
Yea i haven't hit a flat line. Some people are describing low libido or low mood as flat line but i was under the impression no sexuality at all or desires would be a true flat line. There hasn't been 1 day so far i haven't been horny.

Pedigree

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2013, 02:27:00 AM »
I'm a believer that there's a difference between a flatline and being a stimulation-free environment. It's just the case that we mistake the latter with the former because we're so used to being stimulated all the time.

grzeg12

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2013, 02:52:23 AM »
I think anyone can precisely definied term "flatline"

Very low desire to sex? How we can have desire to sex if we avoid sexual fantasies.

What most be suitable for term "flatline" is when some man try to avoid masturbation after watching porn for a long time, and he sometimes starting see days of libido when dick starting stand up. The rest of days is flatline. So i can say I'm still in flatline.
But I can describe it after I have permanent good libido and desire to sex.

TrainingTheDragon

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2013, 05:32:45 AM »
I think anyone can precisely definied term "flatline"

Very low desire to sex? How we can have desire to sex if we avoid sexual fantasies.

What most be suitable for term "flatline" is when some man try to avoid masturbation after watching porn for a long time, and he sometimes starting see days of libido when dick starting stand up. The rest of days is flatline. So i can say I'm still in flatline.
But I can describe it after I have permanent good libido and desire to sex.

Having the desire for sex while avoiding natural fantasies is what we call natural libido.

A flatline is an extended period upwards of a week where you have a no sexual desire or any kind of activity in your pants. It's not something that happens every couple of days.

Basically yes, it is possible to have few sporadic days where you feel some signs of life over the process but overall you have zero urges or activity in your penis as a result of not watching porn and/or masturbating.

I'll refer folks to this article on YBOP: http://www.yourbrainonporn.com/i-quit-porn-but-my-potency-and-libido-are-decreasing-help

Hopefully, it will help you identify whether you're in a real flatline.

Personally, I don't feel urges these days except for a few minutes in the morning. But I still won't say I'm in a flatline. I've experienced it before and it totally sucks lol. Your dick shrivels up and you feel like you don't have a penis. Even sexual thoughts don't bring about a reaction and that's the scariest part.

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2013, 05:57:38 AM »
Man, I think I'm flatlining right now, my penis is so small and soft, I have no urges to masturbate, or to have sex, yet something makes me want to look at women still in a sexual way. Today I saw a girl with such a nice ass, but it did not arouse me, which makes me confused. I appreciated the ass as being very nice and sexy, but it didn't have any impact upon my emotions or my penis.

TrainingTheDragon

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2013, 06:07:06 AM »
Man, I think I'm flatlining right now, my penis is so small and soft, I have no urges to masturbate, or to have sex, yet something makes me want to look at women still in a sexual way. Today I saw a girl with such a nice ass, but it did not arouse me, which makes me confused. I appreciated the ass as being very nice and sexy, but it didn't have any impact upon my emotions or my penis.

Lol, that can be quite scary. Hang in there. Don't even think about testing yourself. It will pass.

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2013, 06:30:52 AM »
Lol, that can be quite scary. Hang in there. Don't even think about testing yourself. It will pass.

Naaaa, I don't even think about testing myself, I'm only at the 30th day. It would be silly to think I'm cured  ;D

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2013, 06:35:18 AM »
Your dick shrivels up and you feel like you don't have a penis. Even sexual thoughts don't bring about a reaction and that's the scariest part.

Yeess Sir. This is what I'm experiencing, even being around my girlfriend my penis is still lifeless, and it looks like a small shrimp.

IV VV IV VV VIII

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2013, 06:38:22 AM »
I've been guilty of this myself, but you're right. And flatline should probably remain a term used only for that specific purpose.
The problem might be that a lot of us don't experience an actual flatline, but still feel weird and understimulated because of no PMO.

When you MO/PMO regularly your libido is in a constant loop. Your desire is constantly building towards the next O, rising and then dropping drastically. When you stop O'ing something else happens. It levels out and that sensation is easily confused with flatlining. 

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2013, 12:49:41 AM »
Hel please, today morning I was kissing with my GF, I had a 60% erection, how bad is it for my flatline? I thought I was flatlining, after we kissed I still have no urge to ejaculate. But I have disturbed my flatline.

TrainingTheDragon

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2013, 12:57:27 AM »
Hel please, today morning I was kissing with my GF, I had a 60% erection, how bad is it for my flatline? I thought I was flatlining, after we kissed I still have no urge to ejaculate. But I have disturbed my flatline.

Why would that be bad for a flatline? Natural arousal is a good thing that helps the reboot. As long as you don't watch P, M or O (if you're not Oing), you'll be fine. Although, if you have ED, you're better off abstaining from O as well.

Habitus

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2013, 02:27:02 AM »
Hel please, today morning I was kissing with my GF, I had a 60% erection, how bad is it for my flatline? I thought I was flatlining, after we kissed I still have no urge to ejaculate. But I have disturbed my flatline.

Why would that be bad for a flatline? Natural arousal is a good thing that helps the reboot. As long as you don't watch P, M or O (if you're not Oing), you'll be fine. Although, if you have ED, you're better off abstaining from O as well.

I was gonna post about this and whether fooling around without M or O is a good idea during the healing period for P induced ED.. Is that the general consensus? that as long as you don't orgasm or m it's fine, beneficial even, to fool around with someone? As I'm so early in rebooting I thought it may be better to completely abstain for a couple if months, then start rewiring.. ?


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Habitus

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2013, 02:28:30 AM »
And sorry to stray off topic


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TrainingTheDragon

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2013, 02:36:15 AM »
I was gonna post about this and whether fooling around without M or O is a good idea during the healing period for P induced ED.. Is that the general consensus? that as long as you don't orgasm or m it's fine, beneficial even, to fool around with someone? As I'm so early in rebooting I thought it may be better to completely abstain for a couple if months, then start rewiring.. ?

Sorry, I wasn't elaborate enough in my last post. If you have ED, the general consensus is to stay away from all kinds of stimulation (from women too) for a while before attempting to rewire. I won't be trying anything until I meet my goal.

ambush

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2013, 07:54:34 AM »
Agreed, people are now using the term “flatline” way too loosely. Some even claim they flatline within a couple of days starting PMO. That makes no sense whatsoever. Individuals are confusing not being horny with flatlining.

I faltlined in the first week of nofap. It was exactly like what a lot of the other account say. And i am still in flat line nearing 90 days. It is not just about not feeling horny. There was a discernible change in mood, increased mindfog etc.

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2013, 03:05:52 AM »
Why would that be bad for a flatline? Natural arousal is a good thing that helps the reboot. As long as you don't watch P, M or O (if you're not Oing), you'll be fine. Although, if you have ED, you're better off abstaining from O as well.

I have ED, I'm abstaining from O, after I O'ed before reboot, I was feeling very wasted. Now I'm gaining some results.

Temple_of_peace

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2013, 03:09:22 AM »
Sorry, I wasn't elaborate enough in my last post. If you have ED, the general consensus is to stay away from all kinds of stimulation (from women too) for a while before attempting to rewire. I won't be trying anything until I meet my goal.

No that's what I'm talking about, I also should be away from women stimulation, for a while.

lte

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2013, 10:31:33 PM »
As I understand it, flatline occurs when the elevated dopamine levels have receded but the D2 receptors are still at a low level.  I never really experienced flatline but I dod go through a period of decreased concentration around day 60. It was weird, I couldn't handle some technical matters at work. Fortunately it passed quickly.

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2013, 11:40:13 PM »
Yeah good assessment LTE. Basically the brain is looking for alternative sources of dopamine, so you could counter the "decreased concentration"  by increasing the amount of exercise, etc.

I hit a flatline 3 days ago, and have to say....it's the great thing ever!

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2013, 02:47:36 AM »
I agree with the topic starter - the term flatline is being used a bit too often. Also I think, that there are people out there, who are claiming they have PIED, while saying in the next sentence that they had sex few days after they stopped PMO - to me that sounds like everything is working as it should...

We should take care that the PIED/Porn-Addiciton doesn't become some sort of "garbage dump", where people are claiming that all their problems came from there.

There were men who had no interest in Sex, other humans had low confidence and social anxiety and other had weird fetishes well before youporn and others came up.

But I can understand, that a lot of us have problems with clearly defining what their problems are.
Some of us never experienced how normal sex drive should look like and media (and porns) are telling us all the day, that males have to be able to fuck everything within seconds and are horny the whole time.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying, that PIED doesn't exist, i'm also affected. But I say, that we all have to take a closure at our live style to rule out any other things which can affect the libido, if we still think that we aren't cured, months after our our last Porn and last Orgasm.

ppycat

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #22 on: November 19, 2013, 12:50:51 AM »
old topic, I don't know how I got here, but I want to say something :-*

what you described as a flatline, the sudden loss of libido after stopping pmo, due to the lack of stimulation, sound perfectly normal and makes sense. however, it involves that if you didn't stop pmo, you could go on to being horny forever, which is not the case. at one point, no matter how healthy you are, if you keep jacking off for years, tens of years (do you even realize how much that is?), your body stops responding and shuts down in order for you to recover. a flatline is not necessarily triggered by stopping pmo, but also by desensitization. if the porn you jack off to doesn't deliver anymore, it's like watching cartoons or anything else non-sexual -> no stimulation -> flatline.

those with extended periods of porn use and escalation problems could then end up flatlining during pmo, because the body needs time to rest. hence why I don't think we should get too involved with semantics and definitions, but a working model of the flatline mechanisms.

little trap: if we go into semantics, a flatline is not a loss of libido. abstaining from pmo removes stimulation, hence your brain stops reacting to your urge of watching porn. that urge is not true libido, so the flatline can never be the loss of libido. it's the loss of the excitement that you used to get before watching porn. since your true libido is inactive (you've been in one for quite a while), it seems like you become asexual for a while. as time passes by, you get your true libido back and that's the end of the flatline.

but I do agree with you, even if some people have low libido for a day, they immediately speak of a flatline, that's not realistic. but then again, our expectations of what it means to be horny are not real either, since we can only compare that with our porn use. porn doesn't resemble reality.

peace ;D


« Last Edit: November 19, 2013, 12:54:03 AM by ppycat »

Brunevii

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #23 on: November 19, 2013, 01:08:00 AM »
Quote
Having the desire for sex while avoiding natural fantasies is what we call natural libido.
How can I have desire for something I never had?

Quote
I agree with the topic starter - the term flatline is being used a bit too often. Also I think, that there are people out there, who are claiming they have PIED, while saying in the next sentence that they had sex few days after they stopped PMO - to me that sounds like everything is working as it should...

This.
These people might be addicted to porn, which is bad in itself, but they need to be distinguished from people whose porn use has fucked up their brains in ways that mean they don't even get morning wood anyway and suffer from E.D.

Dan82

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Re: Has the meaning of 'flatline' changed?
« Reply #24 on: November 19, 2013, 01:20:46 AM »
old topic, I don't know how I got here, but I want to say something :-*

what you described as a flatline, the sudden loss of libido after stopping pmo, due to the lack of stimulation, sound perfectly normal and makes sense. however, it involves that if you didn't stop pmo, you could go on to being horny forever, which is not the case. at one point, no matter how healthy you are, if you keep jacking off for years, tens of years (do you even realize how much that is?), your body stops responding and shuts down in order for you to recover. a flatline is not necessarily triggered by stopping pmo, but also by desensitization. if the porn you jack off to doesn't deliver anymore, it's like watching cartoons or anything else non-sexual -> no stimulation -> flatline.

those with extended periods of porn use and escalation problems could then end up flatlining during pmo, because the body needs time to rest. hence why I don't think we should get too involved with semantics and definitions, but a working model of the flatline mechanisms.

little trap: if we go into semantics, a flatline is not a loss of libido. abstaining from pmo removes stimulation, hence your brain stops reacting to your urge of watching porn. that urge is not true libido, so the flatline can never be the loss of libido. it's the loss of the excitement that you used to get before watching porn. since your true libido is inactive (you've been in one for quite a while), it seems like you become asexual for a while. as time passes by, you get your true libido back and that's the end of the flatline.

but I do agree with you, even if some people have low libido for a day, they immediately speak of a flatline, that's not realistic. but then again, our expectations of what it means to be horny are not real either, since we can only compare that with our porn use. porn doesn't resemble reality.

peace ;D

great explanation.